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You want to work with a ETF Savings Plan broad and inexpensive invest?
Then you should not only focus on the right ETF, but also on one of the Top supplier for an ETF savings plan throughout Switzerland.
What options are available in Switzerland for a savings plan and where you can inexpensive and simply invest you can find out in this article!
Have you also experienced this: You have read on the internet or elsewhere about ETFs and would now like to Fund savings plan organise your finances conveniently?
Until a few years ago, there were hardly Swiss Provider for inexpensive ETF savings plansbut that's over now!
More and more suppliers have finally noticed the high demand and are now offering you in the Switzerland ETF Savings Plans on. Find out where and how best to proceed here!
There are two methodsto be able to implement an ETF savings plan throughout Switzerland. At Method 1 you select all ETFs yourself and save monthly.
Or you can choose Method 2 and work with a Predefined ETF portfolioin which you invest on a monthly basis.
If you want to design your own ETF savings plan and implement your own ETF strategy, you need a provider that allows you to do so.
With the following ETF providers you can Own ETF portfolio implement. Some allow automatic Savings plansfor others you have to manually monthly (or at other intervals) the Purchases Trigger.
| Comparison factor | Swissquote | Yuh | Neon Invest | Saxo Bank | Degiro |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
 |  |  |  |  | |
| 📲 Automatic ETF savings plan? | Yes | Yes | Yes | Yes | No, only manual |
| 📋 Available ETFs | + 1000 pieces | + 40 pieces | + 90 pieces | + 3000 pieces | + 2000 pieces |
| ✔️ Can individual ETFs be traded free of charge? | ⭕ | ✔️ | ✔️ | ✔️ | ✔️ |
| 💲 Trading fees | From CHF 5 for shares and ETFs. Thereafter staggered prices. | 0.5% of the order volume as a lump sum. | 0.5% on all ETFs and 1.0% on international equities. | 0.08% or min. CHF 3 of the order volume (Classic) | From CHF 1 Or fee + CHF 1 Processing fee |
| 💱 Currency exchange | 0.95% | 0.95% | Included! | 0.018% for CHF / USD (with Saxo Classic) | 0.25% |
| 💰 Custody account fees | CHF 20 - CHF 50 charged quarterly and depending on the custody account volume | Free of chargeno monthly or annual fees. | Free of chargeno monthly or annual fees. | 0.22% (Classic) or max. CHF 10 per month. Free of charge for securities lending | Free of chargeno monthly or annual fees. |
| 👎🏻 Disadvantages | Trading user interface for beginners takes some getting used to at first | Not a web solution. No longer suitable for large volumes due to lack of functions and costs. | Not a web solution. No longer suitable for large volumes due to lack of functions and costs. | No entry in the share register possible | - securities loan - No CH deposit protection |
| 🎁 Voucher | Bonus received! | Bonus received! | Bonus received! | Bonus received! | Bonus received! |
You don't want to build an ETF portfolio yourself, but would rather rely on the expertise of a low-cost asset manager?
Then you can use a Robo Advisor. These offer you Customised, ready-made ETF strategies to choose from. The costs are then not charged per purchase, but as a percentage of the assets under management.
How does it work? As soon as you send money to a robo advisor, it is automatically invested there. You can therefore set up a standing order with your bank to the Robo Advisor to have your money invested there automatically.
| True Wealth | Finpension Invest | Findependent | Selma Finance | Clevercircles | Inyova | Kaspar& | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
 |  |  |  |  |  |  | |
| Management fee | 0.25 - 0.50% | 0.39% all-in-fee | 0.29% - 0.40% | 0.42% - 0.68% | 0.45% - 0.65% | 0.6% - 1.2% | 0.57% - 0.85% |
| Product costs | 0.14% - 0.22% | 0.08% - 0.1% | 0.12% - 0.23% | 0.22% | 0.15% - 0.20% | - | - |
| Minimum investment | CHF 8'500 | CHF 1 | CHF 500 | CHF 2'000 | CHF 5'000 | CHF 2'000 | CHF 1 |
| Special advantages | - Extremely cheap - Optimized for Swiss francs - Optional sustainable investment - Desktop and mobile app - Uncapped state guarantee for cash deposits - Children's depot | - Savings plans for deposits and withdrawals - Up to 10 strategies - Tax benefits for ETFs and management - Private equity access - Pension plan and vested benefits also available | - Very cheap - Low minimum investment - App and desktop solution - Children's depot | - Very cheap - Optional Sustainable Investment - Pillar 3a - App and desktop solution | - Community approach - App and desktop solution | - Focused Sustainable Investment - Pillar 3a - App and desktop solution - Children's depot | - Rounding up function - Children's depot |
| Disadvantages | - Minimum investment for beginners a bit high | - Only with residence in Switzerland | - No pillar 3a | - Fees could be lower | - Fees - No pillar 3a | - Fees | - Few setting options |
| Promotion? | 0.25% Fee reduction In the 1. year | CHF 25 fees for free | CHF 20 starting bonus | CHF 34 Start bonus | CHF 100 starting bonus | 6 months no fees + Plant 2 trees | CHF 12 Start bonus |
| Schwiizerfranke Rating |  | |  |  |  |  |  |
| Test report | Test report | Test report | Test report | Test report | Test report | Test report |
But is the possibility of an ETF savings plan available to Swiss people?
Yes, a Classic ETF savings plan is available. Until a few years ago, there were only robo advisorwhich you could use. But more recently, you can also find a comparison of fund savings plans throughout Switzerland. Swiss broker! Some good providers from both categories? Swissquote, True Wealth, Selma Finance or about Yuh.
Which Options for a Swiss ETF savings plan So there is?
Foreign suppliers:
Abroad, there are a few ETF savings plan providers that offer us in Switzerland with very inexpensive conditions are available. This may have disadvantages, but the costs are usually lower. One example would be the provider Degiro from the Netherlands.
Swiss supplier:
Swiss deposit guarantee and local regulation is better for you? Then there are providers like Swissquote, True Wealth or perhaps Selma Finance. At Swissquote, you can manually create an individual savings plan. With the Robo Advisorn you can set up a standing order for this and then have it automatically invested in ETFs for you.
I see. Can you be specific about a few vendors?
Sure, let's start with a foreign one.
"Intelligent people learn from the mistakes of others".
We have compiled our top selection for you from all our tests and experience reports:
Some Swiss use DEGIRO for their Shares and ETF savings plans. The conditions are fair and many ETFs can even be saved free of charge. We have been testing the Dutch provider, which is regulated by the German BAFIN, since spring 2021!
DEGIRO is Not regulated in SwitzerlandHowever, this has no significant negative consequences. DEGIRO was repeatedly recommended to us by readers, which is why we carried out a test there. There are currently no ETF savings plans, but the Conditions are very attractive therealso the operation, as you can see in our DEGRIO Review.
With Swissquote you will find the leading Swiss online broker for ETFs, Shares, Bonds and cryptocurrencies, for example. We have been investing with the platform for some time and are very satisfied with it. Swissquote offers Extremely many ETFs an, various trading venues and compared to shares even more lower prices on ETFs.
Swissquote savings plans have been available since the end of 2022. A reduction in costs was also announced almost at the same time!
When you work with a Swiss broker an ETF savings plan you want to put on, is Swissquote a very good choice.
For us, Swissquote is currently the best option for recommending an ETF savings plan to Swiss investors. Should you opt for Swissquote during the registration process, enter the * promotional code MKT_SWIIZERFRANKE on. This will even give you the first CHF 100 in trading fees for free.
The still young Robo Advisor Findependent now also offers its own ETF investment solution since the end of 2021.
At Findependent you can choose from pre-selected ETFs (over 30 different ones) select the appropriate ETFs and very favourable save.
So feel free to take a look at our Findependent Review an. Also, if you want to know more about the Findependent vs Swissquote comparison.
Your key to success! Discover our top recommendations from real testimonials.
The basic idea for many ETF Investors are the passive investing. The aim is to diversify broadly on a regular basis, invested without special timing/trading can be made. In neighbouring Germany, many low-cost direct banks are available. Unfortunately, this is not yet the case here, but there is a lot happening on the market. If you don't like Swissquote, for example, you can also use robo advisors such as Selma Finance, Finpension Invest or perhaps True Wealth take a closer look.
Because such providers sometimes offer Savings plan functions and are somewhat clearer and easier to understand than some brokers. There you specify your goals, receive a suggested investment strategy and can also choose, for example Save in sustainable ETFs.
The Taxation of shares and ETFs in Switzerland is a topic in itself. As an investor, you should therefore definitely take a look at our Article about this look at. In short, however, it can be said that as a private investor you do not pay any taxes on capital gains. But you do pay Taxes on dividends paid out from your ETF savings plan and from dividend shares.
The above points have shown you some ways in which or where you can best to buy ETFs can.
There is no one right or best way to buy ETFs in Switzerland. Rather, you should ask yourself, how much effort you are willing to put into it. Also ask yourself whether you really want to create and maintain your own ETF portfolio (keyword: "ETF portfolio"). Rebalancing).
Alternatively, you can also use a robo advisor and buy your ETFs and other investments there conveniently for you. Also the ETF Tax Report is much easier with it, as a tax statement is generated automatically.
In the search for the Best fund savings plan in Switzerland many people come across the Swissquote fund savings plan.
Swissquote has been a listed bank with us for several years. ETF Savings Plan Switzerland Provider. However, since the Swissquote savings plan was added later, the leading Swiss online broker now also secures a top place in the ETF savings plan Switzerland comparison.
As Swissquote has been a winner in our tests for years, we have reached an agreement with the team for all Schwiizerfranke readers: With the promotional code MKT_Schwiizerfranke you get a 100 franc trading voucher in the form of trading credits. Use it!
Your key to success! Discover our top recommendations from real testimonials.
Fortunately, the ETF Savings Plan Swiss with more and more local providers to choose from. Swissquote is the dominant Swiss online broker for an ETF savings plan. Also in the smartphone app Yuh you can execute a savings plan.
Foreign suppliers such as Degiro are particularly inexpensive, but also come with disadvantages, as you will see in the Comparison you can see.
Where there is also a favourable starting point with a limited selection (more than 30 ETFs after all) is Findependent.
Alternatively, you can also click on Selma or True Wealth and there comfortably Investments can be automated.
Where do you open your Switzerland ETF savings plan? Let us know in the comments!
Your Schwiizerfrank team.
84 responses
Dear Eric
I am very interested in the following topic. For example, if I save an MSCI World ETF in dollars via Swissquote and at some point there is an extremely large dollar crash (keyword: over-indebtedness of the USA) and the dollar has lost a lot of value in recent years anyway and does not have a rosy future. To what extent will the currency crash then have an impact on the capital saved? Will a large part of the capital be gone as a result of the currency crash? What are the consequences?
There are also ETFs where the currency is hedged. What are the consequences of such an ETF in the event of a dollar crash? Is an ETF where the currency is hedged the best solution?
Thank you in advance for your explanation.
Hello Ramon,
Thank you for your question and the interesting consideration. This is exactly what we will be covering in the free webinar in January.
Swiss investors should definitely be aware of the currency risk. In the FinanzFahrplan, we therefore structure strategies in such a way that they are not exposed to an unnecessarily high USD or euro risk.
Unfortunately, some people on social media recommend that you should simply buy an all-world ETF and your portfolio will be complete. This advice is generally not good and is risky for people in Switzerland!
So take a look at the free webinar in January or in FinanceTimetable over.
Kind regards,
Eric
Hello Eric
Extremely great platform you have here. My compliments on what you have created here! I'm brutally enthusiastic! The added value you offer here is incredible.
A year ago, I opened a custody account with VZ with a somewhat naive attitude. The sole reason for doing so was so that I could save in an ETF with lower fees than a fund at my house bank. At that time, I didn't have too much knowledge about ETFs. In the meantime I have learnt more and would like to manage the ETF myself and benefit from lower fees, as these eat into the return. I would like to save in an MSCI World with Swissquote. The fees at VZ in addition to the TER are 0.55% flat rate. So all in all around 0.75% in total.
What about the exchange rate fee at Swissquote if the ETF is in dollars? Don't the exchange rate fees (up to 1%) eat up a lot of the return? The trading centre would be the Swiss stock exchange. It is not clear to me what effective costs are to be expected in addition to the TER if, for example, CHF 1,500 is invested quarterly in the iShares Core MSCI World UCITS ETF IE00B4L5Y983. The currency of the fund is the dollar. Could you please clarify this for me with an example calculation? The TER is 0.20%. What additional costs are there in addition to custody account fees at Swissquote? I am asking because I could theoretically deposit the same ETF with VZ, but the annual costs are 0.75%, i.e. TER plus the VZ flat fee of 0.55%. Perhaps the package at VZ is not too bad after all with all the additional costs from other platforms when these are added together?
Thank you very much for the clarification, which I greatly appreciate.
Thank you so much for your positive feedback, Ramon, I'm delighted! 🙂
It's a bit difficult to extrapolate here in the comments section. But let's look at it in simplified terms: Purchase costs including exchange rate fees are only due once (or when buying and selling). On the other hand, ongoing high fees in the form of a TER or otherwise, burden your investments for all future years.
An exchange rate fee on purchase is therefore quickly exceeded by ongoing annual fees.
The VZ or other robo advisor naturally also pay these fees and therefore charge them to you in the form of their ongoing fees. If a provider engages in frequent rebalancing, even higher costs are incurred.
You can see the total fees for your ETF purchase here in the Swissquote contribution 🙂
Kind regards,
Eric
What do you think of fianzen.net zero? You can also open an account there as a Swiss citizen. But I'm not sure about the taxes.
Hello Rolf,
Thanks for the tip! I didn't know about the offer or that Swiss people are also allowed to invest there. I'd be happy to take a closer look. If it is relevant, there will be a blog post about it 🙂
I am also very interested in this provider. However, the account is held in EUR. As a Swiss citizen, isn't that a bit of a risk?
This is definitely a risk that should not be underestimated. In the last 30 years, the euro has lost a good 43% in value against the franc. Accordingly, the currency risk should always be considered when investing abroad.
What is the current situation with YUH and the savings plans? Which ETF would you recommend there as a beginner with 300 to 500 francs per month?
For reasons of diversification, it makes sense to have the Global Blue Chips in CHF (MSCI World) or in USD (FTSE All World). If you want to take a factor into account, there is also the FTSE All World High Dividend or the MSCI World Momentum.
Are they available at Yuh?
hi there!
the idea is to start an etf-savings plan or just with a one-time-payment in switzerland, which is listed in chf. chf is traded anyway as a flight currency, would that make sense or does it not matter whether it is listed in chf or usd? one is chf-hedged and the other normal-usd (world-etf) would there then be possibly unpleasant tax aspects to consider in de?
best regards
You should definitely consider taxes when choosing an ETF. The fund domicile is crucial. Feel free to look at this contribution an.
Good day,
Wanted to ask what you think of findependent? So better said, an ETF bold or risky, are very Swiss-heavy companies in it. Do you think they are well positioned there?
Thanks already.
LG Fabian
Hello Fabian
please comment directly here in the Findependent contribution and please take another close look at their asset classes there.
They diversify globally 🙂
Dear greetings
Eric
Exciting discussion and as I already have a Swissquote account, I will probably go down the route of investing CHF 1,000 every 3 months. My question: Which specific MSCI World ETF do you use? I will probably choose CHF as a basis to reduce potential currency risks. Thanks and LG, Matthias
If you want to invest in just one ETF, with very broad diversification, then in my mind there is only the iShares MSCI ACWI ETF from BlackRock or the Vanguard FTSE All-World UCITS ETF.
If you prefer to hold in CHF, the Vanguard All World ETF DIST in CHF would also be an option (available via Swissquote - I have not found an option at Degiro to invest in CHF-listed ETFs of the two proposed products)
Please don't take my lines as a buy recommendation, just a personal preference. I myself am a big Vanguard fan, because Vanguard as a cooperative upholds the interests of its members. In Swissquote you can find the Vanguard All World ETF under the stock symbol VWRL.
I stumbled across this website the poorswiss by chance during the summer holidays and read through the comparisons. I do my own ETF saving with VZ Vermögenszentrum. It's OK, but it's also cheaper. Now I've actually opened an account with IB (interactive brokers) and am buying my conservatively boring Vanguard Total World Stock ETF (VT) in USD myself (TER 0.08% / >9,000 number of shares) on the US stock exchange. Our EU neighbours are no longer allowed to do this. It could hardly be more favourable. Yes, currency risk has already been mentioned several times. I've opened another account with FlowBank and have already traded, but can't really say much about it yet. I still need to gain some experience.
I am a customer of both Degiro and Swissquote. I am satisfied with both brokers - the price-performance ratio is right for me with both. Regarding your comment on Degiro's negative rating on Trustpilot: I admit it's not very high. But to be fair, you could also mention that Swissquote has a lower rating.
Thanks for your great and helpful posts though!
LG
Hey, Phil,
Thank you for your comment about the Swissquote rating! In my opinion, this platform cannot be recommended to every "beginner" precisely because of the complexity of Swissquote.
By the way, I've been testing Degiro for some time now and can now put my conclusion into perspective! 🙂 Thanks to everyone who "worked on" me here to give the platform a chance!
The detailed review should be published in June.
Does anyone know the app OSKAR?
Hi Georg, I know Oskar (but I'm not a customer). Oskar is currently only offered to customers in Germany & Austria.
Dear greetings
Eric
I tried to set up an Oscar account for my kid. I can't! It needs a German address. With Quirion I almost did it but unfortunately it failed because of the foreign non biometric passport of the second legal guardian (my wife). But it seems that Quirion has no problem with Swiss.
Has anyone had any experience there?
Hello Georg, have you already seen the offer for children from Inyova seen?
No, I don't. Is that what? With automated ETF savings plan?
you make a standing order to Inyova and the strategy set there is automatically implemented with each new deposit
No, I don't know... Does anyone know the Investli app? Sounds like purchase costs of 2% per order... starting at 50 without further custody and other costs, or am I missing something?
To me, it looks like a typical "Lean Startup MVP" - i.e. a half-finished product or landing page where the market is being tapped or investors are being sought. I'm curious to see if anything concrete will come of this.
I was lucky enough to be able to set up an ETF savings plan (savings account) with Swissquote. But this offer is unfortunately no longer available, actually incomprehensible!
haha really? when was that?
I opened the 'Dynamic Saving' account about 10 years ago. You can still find information about it on the Internet. Why this offer was discontinued is a mystery to me. I save in 7 different ETFs per month for a fee of only CHF 9 (not per ETF but for all 7!).
Is there a plausible reason why ETF savings plans are not offered?
Hello Georg, I did not know that before. At which bank was that?
One can only speculate here - perhaps because the low fees generate too little income for certain institutions?
That was at Swissquote. Google 'dynamic savings account Swissquote'.
I have been researching ways to save in ETF savings plans at reasonable prices for years. Unfortunately, in the "banking country" of Switzerland, it is apparently not possible to bring competitive products onto the market, such as those that have long existed in Germany (Scalable, TradeRepublic, etc.). There is still nothing sensible for children. These robo-products may look chic, but they are all far too expensive. All that remains is to do exactly what Eric writes: Make a standing order to his Swissquote custody account and invest it when it contains at least 4,000.
Hey, Daniel,
the solution for children I miss unfortunately also still very strong!
At Swissquote there is actually no minimum investment amount of CHF 4,000 - how did you get this information?
Which of course has to be said: Robos are getting cheaper and cheaper and usually (at least the ones presented here on Schwiizerfranke) implement a typical global portfolio. If the technology is the same/comparable and the costs are lower, there are only a few arguments why you should build your own ETF portfolio. For "freaks" 😀 perhaps yes, especially as a learning process. But does every beginner who doesn't really want to dive too deep need to do this? I don't think so, but would rather recommend a solution like True Wealth or Selma.
Dear greetings
The CHF 4,000 is a rough guide and comes from the fact that I set myself total cost targets. Even the cheapest ETFs at Swissquote cost CHF 14 per order (including fees), while the slightly more expensive products cost around CHF 40 per order. In my opinion, investments of less than CHF 3-4,000 don't really make sense. I firmly believe in fact- and evidence-based investing (tendency to the centre, EFT, ...), the globally diversified ETFs (MSCI, ACWI, ...) hardly differ from each other in the long term. The decisive difference between a long-term strategy leading to a million or "only" to CHF 800,000 (figuratively speaking) is the cost. With my strategy (monthly deposit of CHF 1,000 until retirement in 2047), 0.68% fees (Selma) result in a reduced return of CHF 90,000.
Correction: I meant EMT (Efficient Market Theory) not EFT.
Great praise though for the great site, only came across it recently as I didn't find any Switzerland specific content on Youtube.
thank you for your positive feedback 🙂
I am very pleased, by the way, that you dive so deep here and perform the cost calculations for you in detail! I'm also glad when regularly other people calculate / research and we get here such a x-fold double-check.
If you buy an ETF World that is traded on several exchanges, which one do you choose and what are the considerations/analysis steps?
Stamp duty is also payable in Switzerland. Spread partly higher than in London (London more volume). However, the purchase fees in London are then higher...with only 4 purchases per year and the lower spread, London would be better in comparison.
What do you think?
I honestly don't understand your criticism of Degiro. Yes, they don't have a banking licence, but they are considered an investment company and are regulated accordingly. Deposit protection applies up to EUR 20,000, and as Hans mentioned above, ETFs are special assets. Very few people will have 20,000 or more lying around as cash in their custody account, so I don't see a problem here. And contrary to what you mentioned above, you can certainly hold cash in your Degiro custody account. Although Degiro invests it in a money market fund, it doesn't hurt me as a user because a) they compensate for any negative returns from this money market fund for up to CHF 3,000 cash (I have never had anything deducted for higher holdings either, on the contrary, my cash there has a better return than in the savings account) and b) you can still access and invest it at any time.
For Swiss people, the account is managed in CHF. The free ETFs are all in EUR, but for most others you pay between CHF 2.5 and CHF 4 per transaction, depending on the stock exchange, which is still significantly less than with Swissquote. And there are no custody account fees either.
So for me definitely definitely preferable to Swissquote & Co.
Hello, Yvonne,
as I said everyone is allowed to form their own opinion on Degiro or other topics. You know my opinion and I respect any counter opinion 🙂
If you look at the development of CHF vs. euro over the last few years, you will quickly notice that saving a few francs in fees does not compensate for the amount of exchange rate losses. You don't even have to be a wealthy investor to do this.
If we are going to talk about costs, then please do so holistically.
Best regards 🙂
I completely agree with Yvonne. I have been using Degiro for a long time. First parallel to cash.ch, meanwhile I mainly only use Degiro. The fees in Switzerland are simply usurious and there is still not a single domestic provider that works with decent fees.
Degiro and Flatex merged in April 2021. Flatex is a German bank and Degiro is now a branch. As competition in Europe (except Switzerland) is high, Degiro has now adjusted its fees further downwards. In other words: Most ETFs can now even be saved for free. Example: If I buy shares in an ETF at cash.ch, I pay around CHF 35 each time. At Degiro it's CHF 0. (Incidentally, the brokers earn the money through commissions from the ETF providers. I find it incomprehensible that customers have to pay for every purchase).
Another example: Every month I buy a few shares of US companies, such as Coca-Cola, AT&T, etc.. At cash.ch I am charged between Fr. 35.- and Fr. 40.- for EACH purchase (brokerage, execution fees, stamp duty, etc). With Degiro I pay 50 RAPPS! So I can invest the money in several stocks every month, for example. Nice side effect: US companies pay dividends every 3 months (I also have stocks that pay dividends every month).
Sorry, but I am no longer prepared to accept these fees from the traditional banks in Switzerland. Every franc I save in fees I can invest in more shares.
I currently have 6 ETFs that I save every month. As a comparison, I take the cheapest provider Swissquote: there I would pay CHF 54 per month (at CHF 9 per purchase & 6 ETFs). That's CHF 648 per year. At Degiro I pay Fr. 0.- for the exact same ETFs per year with the new prices: CHF 0. I save CHF 648 per year, which I can reinvest instead of giving to the bank. By the way: Degiro does not charge custody account fees! Swissquote, cash.ch and co. charge a lot more.
There's no reason to blow your hard-saved money on fees.
Yes, the money parked with Degiro is invested in a money market fund and compensated by Degiro up to an amount of CHF 3000 (in the event of negative performance). In all the years I have been with Degiro, I have not lost a single centime because of this. On the contrary, I have even been credited with money in the event of positive performance.
By the way: In the unlikely event that Degiro goes bankrupt, all investments such as ETFs, shares, etc. are protected. Quote: "Should something happen to DEGIRO, your investments will not be treated as recoverable assets for DEGIRO creditors."
Everyone has to know for themselves whether they are prepared to pay horrendous fees when they can get the same product and the same service much cheaper or even for free. But as a banker once told me, as long as the Swiss are willing to pay these overpriced fees, not much will change.
Thanks for your detailed comment Dani! 🙂 I definitely understand your points and I understand everyone who still invests with a local provider. However, what I really hope is that the Swiss market will hopefully be woken up and shaken up by a local broker very soon - so that the market finally gets fair prices and also state of the art user interfaces as known from online brokers from abroad! 🙂
Hoi Dani and Yvonne
You're both very enthusiastic about Degiro.
I'd be interested to know if you guys decided on basic or custody.
Dani has apparently invested in accumulating ETFs that pay out dividends. I'm already thinking about whether I should choose custody (no borrowing of securities => more security) or basic (no distribution costs).
Of course everyone has to know for himself, but I would be interested in your experience here.
LG, Flavio
Hey, I want to invest in ETFs passively. I've been looking at robo advisors and would rather invest manually in a few ETFs like the MSCI World to get some experience. However, I want to start with a small amount and wanted to ask which broker you guys suggest. Residence is in Switzerland. I have already looked at Swissquote and find the fees too high for small amounts.
Which broker can you recommend to me? What are the alternatives?
Hello Marco,
Why don't you take a look at Findependent? We're currently testing it here and a review will be published soon. It's right up your street. When you open an account with Findependent, enter the code "MerciSchwiizerfranke". You will then receive a bonus on the fees!
Dear greetings
Thank you very much for the answer. However, Findependent is very similar to Selma and the other Robo Advisors. I want to choose my own ETfs and build my own portfolio. Something along the lines of Swissquote. Are there any other alternatives out there? I have heard of Degiro or Interactive Brokers.
Currently I'm testing another Swiss broker, the review will come at the beginning of April. You can be curious about it 🙂
My personal opinion (which is backed up by some feedback from readers) about Degiro can be found here on the blog again and again. Personally, I prefer to pay a little more and have a reliable broker. For me, Degiro is therefore nothing.
I have not yet tested Interactive Brokers (from the USA - tax issues, exchange of information, ... there are a few issues to consider here).
Which broker are you talking about? You could tell me the name 😉 .
Patience is an important quality as an investor 😀 stay tuned
Hello Eric
First of all, thank you very much for all your great reviews and information, which are making it much easier for me to make up my mind about ETF "savings plans". Before I finally decide on an option (I'm currently leaning towards True Wealth), I'd like to ask when you'll be posting the review of another Swiss broker. Or do you already have it and I just haven't seen it?
Thank you for your feedback and best regards
Sarah
Hello Sarah
thank you for your positive feedback!
The review is still in the pipeline and has been finalised from our side... we are still waiting for some final feedback on the costs. We have made a comparative calculation here and naturally want it to be correct.
If you've already opted for a passive investment strategy like True Wealth, I don't think you need to wait for this... 🙂
Otherwise, I hope we can publish in a few days.
Love!
Eric
Thanks so much for your quick feedback Eric!
Great, I'm looking forward to the review. True Wealth I find really not bad. But I would prefer a broker where you can choose the ETFs yourself and the fees are so low that you can invest monthly (even smaller amounts). But we'll probably have to wait a little longer in Switzerland until that's possible.
Greetings Sarah
I hope it doesn't last much longer.
This week I had a conversation with an asset manager in Zurich. We also discussed this topic. I was told that this is part of consumer protection - small investors are kept away from the "casino of the rich" - the stock exchange - by fees.
I still don't really know what to think of this statement... For me, the stock market is definitely not a casino and should certainly not be kept from a privileged audience.
Invest for the long term, hold, diversify and keep fees low. They have been successful with this over the last 150 years and my forecast looks just as good for the future 🙂
Love!
Ah exciting. As is so often the case, it's a question of personal responsibility. I think you could trust small investors more. And just because someone has more money at their disposal doesn't mean that they can handle it better and therefore need less "protection". But well, we'll see what the future brings.
Kind regards
I agree! 🙂
Hi Eric, is there an update yet or have I missed something?
Hi Matthias, the last few weeks the following updates came to the blog on this topic:
Saxo Bank Review
Findependent Review
Degiro Review
Thanks Eric; so 2:1 for Degiro against Swissquote if you want to invest mainly in standard ETFs despite EUR risk?
As far as the fees are concerned, definitely. However, how much you prioritise the CH aspect is very individual (for some, this is THE decisive factor) 🙂 I have tested both and both products have their merits. Unfortunately, the confusing/complex trading interface still bothers me with Swissquote - especially when beginners ask me about a good platform.
Hello
I have another question regarding the exchange rate. If I set up my own savings plan with an ETF in EUR or USD, I always lose out on the exchange rate. With PostFinance it is over 1% worse than with Swissquote (EUR/CHF). I also have the same problem when withdrawing. How do you do it? Do you factor in the exchange rate loss or do you use CHF ETFs?
LG
Hey TH
The exchange rate issue is important and unfortunately often forgotten. In addition to the fees for currency exchange, you also have the so-called exchange rate risk. When the Swiss franc is strong, we have high purchasing power in USD, for example. But if the ETF is then sold one day or the dividends come, this can become a disadvantage.
There are ETFs with "CHF Hedge" as a currency hedge. However, this always costs a small fee and the TER is often somewhat higher.
Personally, I prefer ETFs in CHF that can be traded on the SIX. Unfortunately, this is not always possible, as the offering does not yet cover everything. But if you are looking for something, you can build up the standard ETFs in your portfolio in this way.
Kind regards
Have you heard of Investli?
Thanks for the tip. I have registered as a beta tester. But the product is not yet available. Hope that finally a reasonable Fintech moves on the Swiss market and solves this issue decently cheap and intuitive! 🙂
investli. ch sounds very interesting in principle.... BUT, a look at the imprint (2 private persons from FL ?!??) doesn't really convince me yet.
I'm probably NOT going to leave my personal details there (yet). They should first get some capital and set up a proper company, including a partnership with a (Swiss) bank for the account and custody account...
Hello everybody!
Thank you very much for the article. I've been following the Madam Monneypenny podcast for some time now. She is very much in favour of ETF savings plans... but she lives in Germany and I always had trouble finding out how it works here in Switzerland. So I did a lot of googling and discovered "justetf". Has anyone had any experience with it?
Otherwise, I'm happy to go with the suggestions presented here. Really super helpful!!!
Many thanks!
Michèle
Hello Michèle
thank you very much for the positive feedback!
Justetf.com is a great platform for comparing individual ETFs! But only for comparison, you can't invest there. Nevertheless, in my opinion a top platform for all ETF "lovers" 🙂 Best regards!
Hello Michèle
"Justetf" is an exciting platform for the ETF search. I use "justetf" and "extraetf". There you can choose your favourite ETF, copy the WKN number and then buy it from your provider. I already have 6 ETFs that I save every month. My broker is degiro.ch. You can buy most ETFs there for free. There are also no custody fees. I would download the app 😉
LG Dani
Hi, I don't really get the difference between a so called ETF Savings Plan and having a standing order to e.g. True Wealth ...
Hi, Vito,
to e.g. True Wealth you can send your money for example on a monthly basis and when it arrives there, all of it will be invested in the one (1) portfolio strategy automatically.
An ETF Savings Plan works like that: A broker offers you to invest in ETFs via savings plan. You can hold money at the bank account of the broker (and hold some part of it in cash if you want to) and start 1 or multiple different ETF saving plans from there on. If you want to you can adapt them all individually at any time.
Hope that makes it more clear?
It would be interesting to know in what way Swiss regulation is better than, for example, Dutch or European regulation. Or how the Swiss deposit guarantee would be useful. Shares and ETFs are special assets, so deposit protection offers no advantages. In the event of bankruptcy, the bankruptcy creditors have no access to the special assets. Only the deposited money is thus better protected, whereby the least deposited such a high contribution with the broker. Degiro has several ratings on Trustpilot (overall, the rating is probably 3.5/5).
For many Swiss people, Swiss insurance is "worth" more than foreign insurance. I am not in a position to judge whether it is really safer. What affects my view of Degiro the most is the lack of a custody account where money could be held in cash.
A 3.5 out of 5 doesn't sound positive to me either, furthermore I have received negative feedback from readers about the platform. DENNOCH everyone is allowed to form his own opinion and create where he wants. Schwiizerfranke should serve as a help, not as a restriction. Therefore, we only recommend service providers with whom we ourselves are satisfied, have had positive experiences and can recommend them with a clear conscience.
Kind regards
Hello, Eric,
What do you think of Strateo, they advertise with 'Test winner, best Swiss broker 2019 and 2018' (SIQT)?
Best regards
Claudia
Hello, Claudia,
I haven't tested Strateo yet - because my alarm bells go off when super sports cars are used as an advertising medium and a broker makes a rather dubious impression for my taste.
If you then read things like "inactivity fee" (if you don't trade shares at least every 6 months you pay a 25CHF fee) then that's not necessarily what I'm looking for personally. The rest of the offer is not to my taste either.
This need not apply to others. If anyone has had experience here, they will be happy to share it! 🙂
Love!
Thank you very much for the interesting article. I would like to know what you think of the ETF savings plan of VZ Vermögenszentrum.
Many thanks and kind regards
Hello Ralph, thank you very much for your feedback!
We have not yet invested with VZ, so unfortunately we are not yet able to provide an experience report. The fees look attractive, but "do it yourself" can be cheaper with Swissquote be cheaper (depending on the size of the deposit). Selma Finance uses the securities solution from VZ Vermögenszentrum, offers an even greater service and only charges minimal fees for this additional service. In the end, everyone is free to choose where they feel they are best looked after at 🙂. The main thing is to do what you want!
To be honest, I can't understand the problem - the competition takes care of that. For example, I open a free account with DKB, which can be done online in a few minutes even as a Swiss citizen - open a custody account there and use it to buy MSCI World - voilà. Despite the prophecies of doom from the Swiss banking industry - there are also regulations and deposit guarantees abroad - and what is good enough for our neighbours in the big canton is also good enough for the Swiss, even if we don't like to admit it.
Of course, if you depend on purely Swiss banks and play local development aid in the financial sector, but then please do not complain about the high price or the inadequate products.
Hello Felix
thanks for your input! Have you perhaps already made experiences regarding taxation and can you draw a comparison?
Of course, there are a few other risks associated with foreign accounts, but let's leave aside the extreme cases. What you have to keep in mind are the exchange fees if you send CHF to Euro accounts and again if you liquidate your investments at some point and want to use the profits in CHF.
I can see your points absolutely! 🙂 Whoever finds a serious (!) broker who offers decent conditions and accepts Swiss can certainly save a bit here. The currency exchange could perhaps be done cheaply with Transferwise Switzerland Experience 2020 do. However, additional work and a few additional risks cannot be avoided.
I would be pleased about detailed long-term experiences!
Love!
Many thanks for the detailed and helpful article! But I have one more question: You say that PostFinance is one of the more expensive providers. According to https://www.postfinance.ch/content/dam/pfch/doc/prod/acc/etrad_cond_de.pdf the cost per order is in fact much higher than with Swissquote (e.g. 35.- for a purchase worth 5k-10k vs. 9.- flat rate with Swissquote). However, the custody account fees are refunded as a trading credit at PostFinance. With Swissquote, on the other hand, you pay up to 200 francs a year for your custody account. So isn't PostFinance even cheaper (provided you don't buy too often)?
Best regards from Basel
Thank you very much for your hint with the credits!
In fact, this is currently offered, but whether the total price is ultimately really more favourable for you depends on your individual investment style. Everyone should check this for themselves and also check whether the desired ETFs are even available from the respective broker.
The Swissquote fees are variable and also depend on your behaviour and volume. Personally, I buy with Swissquote, but always for at least 1000CHF, so that the fees remain favourable in relation. It doesn't always have to be monthly...
I have my ETF savings plan with Selma. Simply set up a standing order and everything is done for me automatically. I can only recommend it!
Hey Marlis, thanks for your feedback! I think it's great, because Selma automatically adapts the strategy to your situation and your goals. (I've already recommended the book "Souverän investieren mit ETFs und Indexfonds" to many people... and then only to be told how dry the book is 😀 So I was also able to learn that not everyone wants to go into so much detail and is therefore very well served by providers like Selma).
LG Eric